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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2017 0:04:02 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I love Taylor... BUT I feel like she's drifting away from her "real" self by saying " She's Dead". Like, I know in this era she's being more "real" and not caring what everyone thinks, but it just seems like not her. I feel like her fashion style has downgraded and she isn't the cute/girly Speak Now and Red era Taylor anymore. And I feel like the performances have been better in the past as well. I love reputation, but there is a handful of songs that I think are kind of not her/lyrically weak. Idk... I just miss the old Taylor, I guess. I honestly feel like this was me in 1989 era lol. Like I lost my resonation with her and felt destroyed but somehow I feel connected with this. I agree there is some lines that don't feel very Taylor but she's also like almost 30 years old. I also wonder if I adjusted to losing old Taylor in 1989 so drastically Reputation didn't punch me like 1989 did. XD
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Post by JDMaleSwiftie on Dec 15, 2017 0:27:10 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I love Taylor... BUT I feel like she's drifting away from her "real" self by saying " She's Dead". Like, I know in this era she's being more "real" and not caring what everyone thinks, but it just seems like not her. I feel like her fashion style has downgraded and she isn't the cute/girly Speak Now and Red era Taylor anymore. And I feel like the performances have been better in the past as well. I love reputation, but there is a handful of songs that I think are kind of not her/lyrically weak. Idk... I just miss the old Taylor, I guess. I honestly feel like this was me in 1989 era lol. Like I lost my resonation with her and felt destroyed but somehow I feel connected with this. I agree there is some lines that don't feel very Taylor but she's also like almost 30 years old. I also wonder if I adjusted to losing old Taylor in 1989 so drastically Reputation didn't punch me like 1989 did. XD I was kind of halfway there. I eventually came to love the album, but it took a long time. I suspect the same will happen with reputation at least I hope so. I’ll admit I wasn’t exactly thrilled with 1989 or where I felt Taylor was heading towards in her career in regards to the change to pop as well as more mature lyrics. Don’t think there is anything wrong with missing the old Taylor, but you’re right she’s 28. I think of myself at age 23 and I’ll be very dissapointed if I’m the same person when I’m 28 or 29, but I digress. There’s just gonna be an acclimation and adjustment period for a lot of people and that’s okay. It’s normal.
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Roman
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Post by Roman on Dec 15, 2017 2:00:25 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I love Taylor... BUT I feel like she's drifting away from her "real" self by saying " She's Dead". Like, I know in this era she's being more "real" and not caring what everyone thinks, but it just seems like not her. I feel like her fashion style has downgraded and she isn't the cute/girly Speak Now and Red era Taylor anymore. And I feel like the performances have been better in the past as well. I love reputation, but there is a handful of songs that I think are kind of not her/lyrically weak. Idk... I just miss the old Taylor, I guess. Yeah, I can imagine that Taylor is done with media, drama and rumors. But she is also trying to forcefully get rid of all the previous (good) things she has done. It's like she has cleaned out her closet and rigorously threw out everything from before Reputation. In my opinion that is bad because it's disrespectful towards her own magnificent work from before and also towards all the fans who still love the previous eras. I agree that she is the most far from herself in this era and the quality of her work and her entire persona dropped. I hope it's just her first life-crisis and she will come to her senses again for the next era.
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Post by taytaytay on Dec 15, 2017 2:22:47 GMT -5
I was the best mod on TC Ouch!
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Post by taytaytay on Dec 15, 2017 2:27:36 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I love Taylor... BUT I feel like she's drifting away from her "real" self by saying " She's Dead". Like, I know in this era she's being more "real" and not caring what everyone thinks, but it just seems like not her. I feel like her fashion style has downgraded and she isn't the cute/girly Speak Now and Red era Taylor anymore. And I feel like the performances have been better in the past as well. I love reputation, but there is a handful of songs that I think are kind of not her/lyrically weak. Idk... I just miss the old Taylor, I guess. Yeah, I can imagine that Taylor is done with media, drama and rumors. But she is also trying to forcefully get rid of all the previous (good) things she has done. It's like she has cleaned out her closet and rigorously threw out everything from before Reputation. In my opinion that is bad because it's disrespectful towards her own magnificent work from before and also towards all the fans who still love the previous eras. I agree that she is the most far from herself in this era and the quality of her work and her entire persona dropped. I hope it's just her first life-crisis and she will come to her senses again for the next era. I don't think it's fair to say she's lost herself when literally everyone who knows her personally is saying she's incredibly happy right now-that's not how those who are lost are generally described. I think she's just grown up and is following the trends more. This applies to both her style (comfy unisex looks have been in for a while, whereas the girly looks she wore in earlier eras like Speak Now and Fearless were also heavily on trend then) and her music (1989 started to latch onto current pop trends at the time, rep is definitely latching on to the popularity of hip hop and rap as well as the electro pop style that has become more common recently). There's nothing wrong with that on my opinion, I think she's just having fun expressing herself in a different way.
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Roman
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Post by Roman on Dec 15, 2017 2:46:38 GMT -5
Yeah, I can imagine that Taylor is done with media, drama and rumors. But she is also trying to forcefully get rid of all the previous (good) things she has done. It's like she has cleaned out her closet and rigorously threw out everything from before Reputation. In my opinion that is bad because it's disrespectful towards her own magnificent work from before and also towards all the fans who still love the previous eras. I agree that she is the most far from herself in this era and the quality of her work and her entire persona dropped. I hope it's just her first life-crisis and she will come to her senses again for the next era. I don't think it's fair to say she's lost herself when literally everyone who knows her personally is saying she's incredibly happy right now-that's not how those who are lost are generally described. I think she's just grown up and is following the trends more. This applies to both her style (comfy unisex looks have been in for a while, whereas the girly looks she wore in earlier eras like Speak Now and Fearless were also heavily on trend then) and her music (1989 started to latch onto current pop trends at the time, rep is definitely latching on to the popularity of hip hop and rap as well as the electro pop style that has become more common recently). There's nothing wrong with that on my opinion, I think she's just having fun expressing herself in a different way. I don't really buy into the whole "I'm happier than ever" thing. That's part of the propaganda that comes from her team and with this era. Taylor is definitely trying hard to get over the stuff that happened the past years. But she's not there yet. And that's okay, it takes time. But I do think it was too early to come back. And I don't agree that she has become more mature. Writing about drinking and sex doesn't make you mature. Actually the whole "my exes were horrible and my new baby is so much better in every aspect" is quite juvenile and it's getting old. I would've liked to see her write about more profound subjects. That would've been a sign of her getting more mature. In my opinion the way Taylor is acting reminds me a lot of teenage behavior. It all started with the bleached hair and the Coachella partying and it's not over. Maybe she is trying to recapture some sort of youth.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2017 12:40:26 GMT -5
I'm starting to feel like its unpopular to actually love Reputation and think Old Taylor exists in this. XD
I do 100% agree singing about sex and drinking does not equal maturity. I've heard really juvenile crap from people singing about that sorta thing. I think Taylor has done everything with class and the integrity she's had her entire career. I don't think she has entirely tossed out every old era thing. Also I think sometimes when you go through a really hard, ugly time, you move forward with the better version of you that arose from the ashes. I honestly tossed all my old songbooks in the trash because of the awful memories some of them brought back and began again. It isn't always ugly to toss some of the old away, sometimes it is genuinely a relief. Now, I'm not saying Taylor even threw it all away. When I heard 1989, I FELT Taylor died then. I felt like she was going through a hard time then, like it felt like she GAVE IN to all the people throwing bricks at her. This is what I find funny. I feel in REPUTATION I found my Taylor again, while everyone feels like they lost her. So its time for my long winded thing.
I did not expect Taylor to come back all peachy after all the crap. Matter of fact, I think it would have been unrealistic. She is a musician and for years she has used her music as a diary to us. From her first album to this one, we're hearing the story of Taylor's life. 1989, I either haven't hit that phase or I missed it because the album did not catch me but a few select songs. I also don't think disliking the music of the album is automatically a reason to say Taylor is suddenly less mature. I thought Shake It Off was possibly the worst written most juvenile comeback to her haters I had ever heard. It was absolutely pathetic to me. Bad Blood was good but it wasn't near as good as her other songs referencing anger.
I honestly feel like Taylor took some of the Blank Space tactics into REPUTATION. She is OWNING her Reputation. She knows what they say, and she is also saying IT DOESN'T DEFINE ME. She is probably sitting back laughing about it now. The poems were very heartfelt, and she expresses how hurt she was but also says, it is going to be OKAY. And I don't know if she would have said that if she didn't feel it would be okay. She's dealt with a lot and I don't blame her for the change of tone. She's a wonderfully nice person, and some of this album just suggests she's starting to put her foot down and say "you don't get to treat me like crap!" Which is EMPOWERING. ITS AWESOME. And I am living that part of my life right now too, telling people to f*** off and that they aren't allowed to treat me less than what I am worth. Would you rather she get hurt again? Listen, I LOVED Speak Now. I love All Too Well. I love a lot of Taylor's music, but if writing another All Too Well means her getting her heart shattered over and over I rather her not get shattered. What I hear in Reputation is someone who'd become doubtful of love, cold, someone angry, someone seeking revenge for the pain she felt after everything. What I also got to hear, is a person who let it go, learned to love again, found warmth in her lover, and learned it didn't matter if they won the battle because her escaping, her finding love again, she won the war. And that meant everything.
and if you think that message, that story, is juvenile or pathetic. Well, so am I. But she says I'll be okay. and I believe her here. Do I think every song is perfect? No. I don't like King of my Heart. Dress is just okay. Gorgeous is just okay. the other songs I do enjoy. But to say you can't find old Taylor on this album is also false to me. 1989, I couldn't find old Taylor. It was heartwrenching to me. I felt like I didn't know her anymore. Reputation, I see her. I see a mix of old Taylor, the good parts, and the new Taylor who arose from the wreckage. No one goes through pain like that without even an ounce of change. If you think she is any different than anyone else you've really gone off the rocker. It doesn't MUSICALLY sound like what we're used to hearing (neither was 1989 fyi) but lyrically. I remember actually crying when Gorgeous came out, because I thought honestly we wouldn't hear another cutesy Taylor love song. Sure the days of You Belong With Me and Stay Stay Stay seem long gone but Gorgeous is just a genuinely cute, sweet lovey dovey song. If King of my Heart was musically more sound to my ear I would probably feel the same about it. Look What You Made Me Do, This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things, have the makings of good angry Taylor music. She is calling out the people who caused her turmoil, not even subtlely. Think of Picture to Burn, think of Better Than Revenge. Songs I love, of course, I love these too. Call It What You Want may genuinely be one of the top 10 Taylor love songs to me EVER. The beauty of it just grabs me so hard. Dammit. Dress, whether I like it or not, is a very classy take on a very sensual song. Do I find the "bought a dress so you can take it off" line totally cliche? Absolutely, but still, compared to the other people singing about sex. 10/10 on classy. ...Ready For It? line you speak of. You tell me if you feel like you found the love of your life you wouldn't totally go "every lover I've known in comparison is a failure." well, they ain't there so they must've been! This is the one song I can't really grasp as being related to anything else and probably the closest one to being "juvenile" on this you might have. I Did Something Bad is probably the most honest, most recklessly damaging song on Reputation and I love she did it. I say recklessly damaging because it basically appears she owned being a serial dater, but if you listen to it, she's actually smart af. She's saying she saw the narcissism and played it, she saw the cracks and worked through them to the end. Was it wise? maybe not. But you also hear the girl who had begun to feel love was a farce and began to almost see love as a game at this point. Brutally honest. Delicate takes in consideration the other person's feelings but also, the struggle of fame. I hear the fame struggle on this album. Do they love me or do they love the fact I'm Taylor Swift and so big and stuff? Well she even said here "This ain't for the best, my REPUTATION'S NEVER BEEN WORSE, SO YOU MUST LIKE ME FOR ME." that doesn't get you AT ALL? Don't Blame Me has the brutal honesty of I Did Something Bad mixed with falling in love for real for the first time in a long while. "Don't blame me, love made me crazy, if it doesn't you ain't doing it right." She almost speaks as if this guy made her feel all the love she known before WASN'T TRUE LOVE. Perhaps this is a theme too. Dancing With Our Hands Tied makes me think of Holy Ground sooo much in elements. The putting us through our paces. I literally gave a friend a line by line discussion breakdown of it. THIS SONG GETS ALL MY FEELS. She had been cold, deep blue, frozen from love, but this person brought her out of the dark. ITS BEAUTIFUL.
That's a lot but the point is, if this is too long for you, If you think Reputation is just petty juvenile bullcrap you need to take a few more listens and stop thinking Taylor is still 16 years old. and I had that thrown at me for 1989, but I'm going to say legitmately Taylor has been through a lot to make some changes and honestly she isn't going to be that Taylor completely, but the best parts of that Taylor still exist and I don't know why so few people can hear it besides me. I feel so connected with thi because 1989 era I thought I'd lost the Taylor who inspired me forever. Reputation brought her back.
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Roman
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Post by Roman on Dec 15, 2017 14:28:41 GMT -5
Jazzy, with the risk of stepping on your toes a bit, I'm going to get a bit personal. Nobody says it's wrong to love Reputation. If it resonates with you and you love it, I'm totally happy for you (and for others who feel the same). But that's something different than reviewing the actual product and analyzing Taylor's actions during this era. It's not about you when people criticize the album or the era. Besides that, you're trying a bit too hard to proof that this is so much better than 1989. It's no problem that you didn't like 1989 that much, but that was probably because you weren't ready for it yourself. From what you've said about Reputation, you would probably be ready for 1989 now. I think you have matured over the last couple of years. And if you would give 1989 a new unbiased listen, you would start to see the beauty of it and love it. The quality of 1989 speaks for itself. Anyway. I agree with you that Reputation is not mindless, there are clear messages behind it. BUT...the album is pretty forced and calculated. It's more like a "produce your 2017 album for dummies" than a heartfelt expression of Taylor's deepest feelings with high artistical value. Ironically Taylor repeated several previous moves and did something similar like other artists instead of creating something new. Taylor simply picked a new genre, threw in some subjects from her life the last couple of years and poured it into a popular mould. The music is too automated (which partly comes with the genre). The lyrics are often more a narration than a beautiful flow of eloquence (like on previous albums). Take Gorgeous for example: she tells us how she feels about Joe, but the words and sound she uses don't really transmit much beauty and genuine emotion. It's nothing like Taylor to fail at that. That's pretty much her strongest quality in songwriting. You can tell from the making of videos that for this album she ran out of ideas quickly and she struggled to squeeze good lyrics into the flat sound. So to sum it up: Taylor definitely had a plan for this album, but the execution is not as creative and high quality as usual. And she didn't show us her deepest feelings about the past years. She kept it shallow and went with the good old new boyfriend theme. Which is not exactly a sign of growth and maturity. In all fairness. Am I making statements that are a little too black and white? Yes. Am I generalizing the songs of this album? Yes. Luckily there are some exceptions. Am I a little harsh for Taylor? Perhaps. But I think it's important to speak up. Did I ask myself if my own vision is blurred somehow? Definitely. I always do. It would be really easy if I would be the only one who's disappointed about the album. I could try to live with it and most of all shut up about it within the community. But the reality is that loads of fans are bitterly disappointed. Quite a few oldschool fans even got alienated by this era. And many more are still in denial that this is far from Taylor's best work. Does this mean I'm done with Taylor? Definitely not. I love her very much. And the fact that her actions are different this time, doesn't mean she has changed a lot. I strongly believe in "in good times and bad times". And I will do whatever it takes to power through this era. That's one of the reasons I'm going to the Reputation Tour. So if you see the crew cleaning up some bones and a pair of glasses, that probably means I failed Joking aside. If you guys hate me for doing things like this, please tell me. I definitely don't want to ruin the mood or hurt any of you.
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Post by taytaytay on Dec 15, 2017 14:38:30 GMT -5
I actually really love that line in Dress ("Only bought this dress so you could take it off") because, like Taylor said, it sounds like a cheap pick up line but it's loaded with so much emotion that it makes it feel totally different. Idk I just think it's nice to have a song that says that sex can be about more than just lust and a way of expressing your genuine feelings for someone.
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Post by JDMaleSwiftie on Dec 15, 2017 15:24:30 GMT -5
I actually really love that line in Dress ("Only bought this dress so you could take it off") because, like Taylor said, it sounds like a cheap pick up line but it's loaded with so much emotion that it makes it feel totally different. Idk I just think it's nice to have a song that says that sex can be about more than just lust and a way of expressing your genuine feelings for someone. It’s a better version of Wildest Dreams IMO. Which is saying a lot because that was a fantastic song as well.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2017 18:30:54 GMT -5
Jazzy, with the risk of stepping on your toes a bit, I'm going to get a bit personal. Nobody says it's wrong to love Reputation. If it resonates with you and you love it, I'm totally happy for you (and for others who feel the same). But that's something different than reviewing the actual product and analyzing Taylor's actions during this era. It's not about you when people criticize the album or the era. Besides that, you're trying a bit too hard to proof that this is so much better than 1989. It's no problem that you didn't like 1989 that much, but that was probably because you weren't ready for it yourself. From what you've said about Reputation, you would probably be ready for 1989 now. I think you have matured over the last couple of years. And if you would give 1989 a new unbiased listen, you would start to see the beauty of it and love it. The quality of 1989 speaks for itself. Anyway. I agree with you that Reputation is not mindless, there are clear messages behind it. BUT...the album is pretty forced and calculated. It's more like a "produce your 2017 album for dummies" than a heartfelt expression of Taylor's deepest feelings with high artistical value. Ironically Taylor repeated several previous moves and did something similar like other artists instead of creating something new. Taylor simply picked a new genre, threw in some subjects from her life the last couple of years and poured it into a popular mould. The music is too automated (which partly comes with the genre). The lyrics are often more a narration than a beautiful flow of eloquence (like on previous albums). Take Gorgeous for example: she tells us how she feels about Joe, but the words and sound she uses don't really transmit much beauty and genuine emotion. It's nothing like Taylor to fail at that. That's pretty much her strongest quality in songwriting. You can tell from the making of videos that for this album she ran out of ideas quickly and she struggled to squeeze good lyrics into the flat sound. So to sum it up: Taylor definitely had a plan for this album, but the execution is not as creative and high quality as usual. And she didn't show us her deepest feelings about the past years. She kept it shallow and went with the good old new boyfriend theme. Which is not exactly a sign of growth and maturity. In all fairness. Am I making statements that are a little too black and white? Yes. Am I generalizing the songs of this album? Yes. Luckily there are some exceptions. Am I a little harsh for Taylor? Perhaps. But I think it's important to speak up. Did I ask myself if my own vision is blurred somehow? Definitely. I always do. It would be really easy if I would be the only one who's disappointed about the album. I could try to live with it and most of all shut up about it within the community. But the reality is that loads of fans are bitterly disappointed. Quite a few oldschool fans even got alienated by this era. And many more are still in denial that this is far from Taylor's best work. Does this mean I'm done with Taylor? Definitely not. I love her very much. And the fact that her actions are different this time, doesn't mean she has changed a lot. I strongly believe in "in good times and bad times". And I will do whatever it takes to power through this era. That's one of the reasons I'm going to the Reputation Tour. So if you see the crew cleaning up some bones and a pair of glasses, that probably means I failed Joking aside. If you guys hate me for doing things like this, please tell me. I definitely don't want to ruin the mood or hurt any of you. I have given 1989 more listens. I have ended up appreciating other songs and others dropped, but in general, there is about 7 solid songs I still even listen to from 1989. Out of the Woods, Clean, Wonderland, New Romantics, How You Get The Girl, Wildest Dreams, and Blank Space on occasion. Musically I did not like a lot of 1989 songs, and imo Shake It Off and Welcome to New York could and should have been scrapped and just put the deluxe tracks there so everyone could appreciate them on the main album. Oh, you weren't here when I originally joined. my entire first thread was a criticism of 1989 lyrically and musically. I didn't like most of Taylor's actions in 1989 either. I don't think I would be ready for 1989 now. I am sorry, but it didn't catch me the way it did you. Same as it appears Reputation did not catch you but it caught me. But certainly we can learn from each other. No hate here.
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Post by Joe 🍀 on Dec 15, 2017 18:48:11 GMT -5
I feel like she is not open minded in the songs as she was in the past.
I am losing the touch of her true feelings in the lyrics.
Its more and more close to the mainstream albums with hits for a few nights.
But its still very good. There are songs I can hear again and again, they are addictive.
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Post by DogLover on Dec 15, 2017 18:54:36 GMT -5
What song do you listen to more?
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Post by Joe 🍀 on Dec 15, 2017 19:05:51 GMT -5
What song do you listen to more? isnt this a question, better situated for my Q&A ? (I am giving you the option to post it again there so you can have +1 post)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2017 19:07:11 GMT -5
also @paintrain , you may have also not seen, but a lot of old fans were alienated by 1989 as well, and left the forum or fandom. some I agree felt even MORE alienated with Reputation, but 1989 has a similar affect.
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